Meet a “Typical White Person.”

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I really hope that what follows makes sense.  You’ll be sure to tell me if it doesn’t, okay?

Headline from Saturday’s Philadelphia Inquirer:

Obama’s “typical white person” makes waves

Story:

Sen. Barack Obama’s description of his grandmother as a “typical white person” in an interview with WIP (610 AM) wound up making waves from the online Huffington Post to YouTube and Larry King Live.

In Thursday’s interview with [local Philadelphia radio] host Angelo Cataldi, the Democrat from Illinois responded to a question about the speech on race he delivered earlier in the week at the National Constitution Center.

In the speech, Obama said his white grandmother “once confessed her fear of black men who passed by her on the street.” He also said she “on more than one occasion has uttered racial or ethnic stereotypes that made me cringe.”

“The point I was making was not that my grandmother harbors any racial animosity,” Obama said on WIP. “She doesn’t. But she is a typical white person who, if she sees somebody on the street that she doesn’t know, there’s a reaction that’s been bred into our experiences that don’t go away, and that sometimes comes out in the wrong way, and that’s just the nature of race in our society…”

Then the reactions started.

“We doubt this story will have legs, but wonder if Hillary Clinton referred to a ‘typical black person,’ would we ever hear the end of it?” Dan Gross of the Philadelphia Daily News wrote on his PhillyGossip blog.

“Seriously, Barack Obama basically called all white people racist. … Is this guy kidding?” wrote Taylor Marsh on the Huffington Post in midafternoon.  [That's not what he said, Taylor.  Read it again.  Slooooowly.]

WIP host Howard Eskin, known for having strong opinions, said during his 3 p.m. show that he was offended by the remark, at one point repeatedly asking a caller who had identified himself as African American if he was “a typical black person.” [For those of you not from this area, Eskin is basically a sports talk "shock jock, who will say almost anything to provoke people.]

“Obama ‘Typical White Person’ Racist Interview” was a headline on an excerpt posted on YouTube.

On Thursday night, Larry King referred to the comments on WIP during an interview with Obama: “You called her today ‘a typical white person,’ meaning what, Senator?”

“Well, what I meant really was that some of the fears of street crime and some of the stereotypes that go along with that were responses that I think many people feel,” Obama replied. “She’s not extraordinary in that regard. She is somebody that I love as much as anybody. I mean, she has literally helped to raise me. But those are fears that are embedded in our culture, and embedded in our society, and even within our own families, even within a family like mine that is diverse.”

Asked whether his campaign might suffer some damage because of the remark, the senator did not directly respond but expressed confidence that Americans could talk honestly about complicated issues and that “if we’re not trying to demonize each other, that we can solve problems.”

Yesterday morning, Cataldi sounded amused by all the controversy. “Only now do I know he was really just calling to give us his NCAA picks. . . . I’m asking him about his white grandmother and he wanted to talk about UCLA, about Duke against Belmont. What a disaster!”

Then he said his own mother called yesterday to rib him about helping Sen. Hillary Rodham Clinton.

Cohost Al Morganti said that CNN invited him to comment on the air, but that the cable network changed its mind because he thought the subject was “no big deal.”  [Emphasis and side comments mine.]

Well, of course it’s not really a big deal.  But it has already become one.   They can’t help themselves but to make it one.  By midday Saturday, this comment was all over the Internet, especially on right-wing blogs, but also on “progressive” ones where Sen. Clinton is the candidate of choice.  And the folks who profit from demogoging this to death were just happy as punch to oblige.  Un-Reconstructed Confederate sympathizer and Holocaust denier Pat Buchanan was ranting about this on MSNBC: his face turned bright red, he was so irate.  As if his reactions somehow represent a “typical white person’s.”  (Why that network continues to drag him out in front of the camera, I do not understand.)  No doubt this will be the focus of Sean Hannity’s narrow, racist universe for a good week or so.

Of course, the real problem is that, once again, Barack Obama is only “in trouble” with these people because he told the truth.

See, there are “typical white people” out here.  Lots of them.  I’m going to bet that most white people are “typical white people,” in the way Obama meant that phrase.

Meet one:

Hello.  My name is Dave.  I’m a “typical white person.”

My mother’s parents had their roots in England, specifically Newcastle and Manchester.  There was also some Pennsylvania Mennonite and a smattering of German on my maternal grandfather’s side.  My father’s family was Scottish on my grandfather’s side, from up around Edinburgh, and English on my grandmother’s: her line can be traced back to early Pennsylvania Quakers.

So, unless there was some stuff going on back there that I know nothing about, I’m about as white-bread Caucasian as you can get.

My late parents were pretty typical white people.  My father harbored a fair amount of anti-black racism: although he never used the “n-word,” he certainly based a number of his opinions on the usual unfortunate stereotypes.  He was fairly dismissive of many black civil rights leaders, for example.  He thought they were “hucksters.”  He didn’t like superstar baseball talent Richie Allen of the Phillies, mainly I think because Allen had the audacity to be a proud black man, Afro and all.  My dad changed, however, as he got older.  Being laid off at 50 changed him.  Having the home he built and paid for burn down in 1982 – after having lived there for twenty years and raised a family in it – changed him.  The fact that so many people of all colors and backgrounds from our community rallied around my parents when that happened softened him, and he died a very different man than the one who raised me.

I was brought up in an almost entirely white southern New Jersey suburb of Philadelphia, Pennsylvania.  I had no black neighbors and hardly any black classmates growing up, until I hit junior high.  I had one black elementary school teacher, Mrs. Richardson, who started out that year as Miss Lott, who was one of the most wonderful and demanding teachers I ever had.  (I’d love to know where she is today.)  She was the first person of color with whom I spent any real time.

I had one black teacher in high school, a man who was something of a mentor to me at a time when my own father and I had grown a bit distant, but no black friends.  There were very few black students in my school, and none of them travelled in my social circle, which, frankly, was pretty darn small.  I had a Asian girlfriend for about a year and a half (she was third generation Chinese-American), and lots of white Jewish and Catholic friends, but that was about it in terms of diversity.

I bet most typical white people were raised in a similar way.

I attended college at Temple University in North Philadelphia, and got a cultural awakening that I am very thankful for to this day.  I had lots of black classmates and a number of black instructors.  I did student teaching at a high school that was about 95% black and 5% Latino in terms of student population, and my cooperating teacher, Carol Ross, was also black.  All that served me well later as I grew into teaching.

But I still had no black friends.  I did not hang out with anyone who wasn’t really a lot like me, in terms of background.

I have taught for twenty-seven years.  I have had many black students and a number of black colleagues.  One of my former black teaching buddies is someone I consider a fairly close friend, as far as colleagues go, who was very helpful to me when I made the switch from adjunct professor to middle school teacher.  She’s retired now, and I don’t see her very often.

Yeah, I know.  I just said that “one of my friends is black.”

I now am a member of a Friends Meeting which is very diverse in its ethnic and “racial” makeup.  We have folks from all backgrounds and creeds.  It’s one of the things I most cherish about it.

But here’s the thing.   I still to this day really don’t have what you’d call many ”friends” who happen to be black.  Certainly no close friends.  I have never broken bread in a black person’s home.  No black person has ever had dinner in mine.  I’ve had plenty of meals with friends of other “races” at restaurants or other functions, but always as part of a bigger group.  Nothing more intimate, the way friends do.  I have some black neighbors – that is, the black people who live in my neighborhood - but I don’t know them.  I don’t talk to them.  The most we do is wave as we drive by each other, as good neighbors try to do.

But I have never stopped to say hello, and they have never stopped for me.

I bet most typical white people are in the same situation.

Does any of this matter?  I think it does.

I read books by black authors, study black history (not just in February, either), listen to music by black artists, watch movies featuring black actors and made by black directors, attend concerts by black musicians, root for black athletes who play for the teams I follow.  Not because they’re black: because I like their work.  But I can’t pretend to know black people from all that.

I do know that I have consciously done things to avoid black people in some situations.  I have felt uncomfortable, or at least more wary, when in situations where I’m sharing space with young black men, for example.  This in spite of the fact that I have worked with a fairly large number of black students over the years, especially when I taught at the community college where I worked for ten years.  Those young men were of the same age as the ones who make me uncomfortable on the street.  I was never uncomfortable with them in a classroom, or on the quad, or in the cafeteria.  But I avoid travelling through certain neighborhoods in Philadelphia.  I am very wary when driving through Camden, New Jersey, a predominantly black city, and I know I don’t take advantage of some of the cultural events and institutions there because they’re “not in a good neighborhood.”  I don’t cross the street to avoid young black males, but that doesn’t mean I’m always totally at ease around them.

I don’t know why I’m “wary.”  Nervous.  Whatever you want to call it.  I just am.  Like most typical white people, I’ll bet.

I know all this about myself.  I’m not happy about it.  In fact, it makes me sad and ashamed.  Especially ashamed.

I’ve been thinking a lot about all this during the past week, since Sen. Obama gave his speech on race when he came to my hometown.  That speech made me think.  It made me do a mental inventory of my everyday racism.  It made me assess – again – what it means to be a member of The Most Privileged Class in America: a white, middle-class male of Anglo-Saxon Protestant heritage.  Of what being that means to the way other people perceive me.  About how others of all colors may assume that I share the prejudices of other members of my tribe, and about how all our assumptions help to build the walls that still exist between us.

I still have a lot of thinking to do, and maybe some praying about it, too.

Maybe I worry about this too much.  Maybe not enough.  You tell me.  Some of you know me well enough by now.  Go ahead.

The problem isn’t with what Barack Obama said.  The problem is that he was right, and that too many white people know it

And we just can’t deal with it.  Maybe we just don’t know how.  Maybe some of us just don’t want to.  And, of course, some of us will just continue to use those words as an excuse to spew more of our own ignorance and hatred.

That’s what makes some – maybe most – of us “typical.”

36 Responses

  1. You are so right. I am a typical white person, therefore I am guilty. Pass me the whip so that I can flog myself out of guilt and shame. I am not worthy…

  2. Yeah, see, that’s exactly the kind of response I was expecting. Thanks SO MUCH for confirming all my suspicions.

    I see I hit a nerve.

  3. Hi Quaker Dave: Good writing. I can see where you are coming from and I get what your experiences have been. However, I don’t think there is such a thing as “a typical white person” anymore than there is a “typical black person” or “typical” anything.

    I think you need to define typical. If by typical, you mean, average, then show me the data. I consider myself definitely average when it comes to experiences with African-Americans and other people of color. I went to private schools most of the time, but there were always people of color in my schools, who never impressed me as being anything other than “normal.” That is, they were no different than the other, mostly Caucasians, in my schools.

    I married a very dark Filippino woman (my college sweetheart). I NEVER, ever, had a fear about people of color that was any different than any of my other fears of people in general.

    I think you make a good point, that we may be in denial about “racism,” but I think it does a disservice to what I think is a vast majority of white people who do not have the so-called “typical fears of blacks” that you characterize as belonging to the typical white person.

    I think there are no such things as completely recovered racists, sexists or “otherists.” We are all “recovering racists, sexists, and otherists” due to the huge legacy that we are all subject to from our historical past. Our task is to recognize the huge legacy the exists just below the surface of our consciousness and deal with it.

    Evolution may be about “survival of the fittest” which tends to set us up to be very territorial (protect our turf), but if humans are going to survive, collaboration and ditching our “otherist” baggage is very, very important.

  4. “Typical” to me, in this context and in the context that Obama was using the word, means that no matter how liberal we are, how progressive we are in our thinking, how we were raised, we are still going to harbor some prejudices. And we still have not been able to open ourselves to all the opportunities to interact with others that might be out there.

    And I would disagree: I think that most white people DO have something of a fear of black people, in certain situations (maybe that wasn’t clear enough: bear with me here). I can’t prove it. Most folks would deny it. But I think it’s there.

    Thanks for your thoughtful reply.

  5. Obama supporters are typical J A C K A S S E S.

    The phrase that will go down in history. They should of let Obama keep stealing speeches. At least he did not stick his foot in his mouth

  6. TYPICAL WHITE PERSON> Now Obama’s true feelings come out. Do you think he won’t have people like Wright in the white house if he wins then your really stupid.

  7. Hi QuakerDave:

    In many ways I have to agree with you. My folks didn’t use the “n” word, but there was always a certain thread of racism that existed in less than overt ways. I think most white folks harbor some racism or they are lying about it. The truth is that many black folks harbor those same feelings. The question is why. The answer is pretty clear if you take a step back and look at the big picture. All of us, black and white, are spoon fed racism every single day, as young children and into adulthood. The news regularly portrays black people as bad, black or Hispanic neighborhoods as bad and dangerous. We hear about fights that happen in predominantly black high schools, but we know that fights happen in all high schools…we just don’t hear about the other ones. Crime also occurs in other parts of the city besides North and West Philly, or parts of New Jersey besides Camden and Newark.

    When we are kids we watch television shows that almost always have the bad guys dressed in black and the good guys dressed in white…think there’s no message in that?

    The unfortunate truth is that black kids and white kids get these messages. They learn at an early age that black represents bad and evil and white represents good and “our hero”. Add to that the media messages about crime which could lead one to believe that crime only occurs in “black” neighborhoods or are committed by only black people. We only hear about crimes committed by white people when they are especially heinous crimes.

    So for me, I work really hard to keep racism out of my head and my heart. Being raised Jewish probably helped a bit….being in a minority group and also because many people consider Jews non-white. That thought makes me happy as I would prefer not to be lumped in with the red-neck ideals associated with the legacy of white privilege. And now as budding Quaker, I am thrilled to be part of a faith group that does real work to both open peoples eyes/minds and does work towards making significant positive change.

    BTW, I also attended Temple as an undergrad and am eternally grateful for the education I received by going to an urban school with so much diversity. I love the university so much that I now teach there. My best classes are usually the ones that are the most diverse because of the richness of experiences that walk through the door. I thank God for the opportunity to learn from my students and what they bring with them. I teach in a department that has absolutely nothing to do with culture and diversity but I insist that it be part of the curriculum in my classes and manage to weave it into as much as I possibly can. I only hope that my students walk away with minds that are slightly more open than when they walked in.

    Enough of my blabbing…sorry for the extra long response…stepping down from my soapbox

    Abbe

  8. Dave, this was courageous. And so too has been Obama’s exploration of these issues.

    I know I have racist ideas, despite my rational understanding of the wrongness of that. I chalk it up to M$M portrayals of blacks, and now Middle Easterners – have you seen any modern shoot-em-up video games??? They’re spectacularly xenophobic and racist, playing on the worst stereotypes imaginable, with most of the “bad guys” looking very Arab and very dark.

    We get fed a steady diet of this stuff, and some of it necessarily informs our subconscious views.

    Talking about it is a good first step in dealing with it. Unfortunately, it seems likely that the folks who could most benefit from this discussion are the ones least likely to be receptive to it.

  9. I know exactly what you mean. I hope Barack Obama will be our next president, but even if he isn’t, I believe he’ll play an important role in blurring the distinctions between the races. I agree with Bill Richardson that he’s a “once-in-a-lifetime leader.”

  10. JJ: They should of let Obama keep stealing speeches. At least he did not stick his foot in his mouth

    That would be “should HAVE,” dude.

    Sheesh.

  11. “clown face”: Do you think he won’t have people like Wright in the white house if he wins then your really stupid.

    That would be “you’re really stupid.”

    “Your” is the possessive. As in “belong to you.” As in “Your comment makes no real sense. Please try again sometime.”

    “You’re” is the contraction for “you are.” As in “You’re just the kind of person who needs to listen to what the man has to say.”

    Just thought I’d help you along there, friend. Peace.

    And, just to address what I think you were trying to say, I’d be a lot more comfortable with Mr. Obama’s friends coming to call at the White House than the pack of criminals and warmongers who now live and work there.

  12. Abbe: Step up there any time. Especially as you’re a Temple alum! Class of ‘80 here.

  13. Velvet: As you can see by the thread, not everyone agrees.

    But that’s okay. Just helped me make my point, by example.

  14. I get the same reaction when i talk about Indian issues, sovereignty, broken treaties, the fact that everybody in America today BUT the Indians are illegal aliens. The problem is that there is a certain segment of white America (NOT like the old woman who flipped you off; at least she was honest in her hatred) who absolutely, positively refuse to discuss race because they refuse to admit or accept any responsibility. At one end, you have those who claim racism NEVER existed, or if it did it wasn’t that bad (Confederate apologists, Pat Buchanan) but on the other hand you have the vast mushy middle that believe all evidence to the contrary that racism was something icky that happened a LONG time ago, like smallpox, and that everybody should just stop talking about it and it would go away. It is EXTREMELY difficult to get through to these folks because they are so mentally (as well as physically and emotionally) segregated that racism is completely beyond their daily experience. In that sense, they are racial atheists, refusing to believe in anything they don’t personally see, feel, touch and hear. And most of the time, if you try to make them understand, they will hate you for making them feel “guilty.” Not sure how or when this attitude will change, though I have hope for the younger generation.

  15. It meant that Obama is racist. He wanted to lynch IMUS for similar remarks along with the other white guilt people going after IMUS. Puff Daddy even jumped on the IMUS ship saying only blacks can call blacks names.

  16. “The problem with arguing with a fool is that he is doing the same. ” Unknown

    That racism is always an issue between whites and blacks is not surprising.

    That racism is always an issue between whites is less known but equally true. In crowd of white people, there is always the fear that one of us is going to turn violently racist.

    I have been surprised in the past two weeks how fearful and distrustful anti-racist whites (including Quakers) are of each other (including Quakers) on the subject of race.

  17. Mr. Imus attacked a group of young women – dedicated, hard-working college athletes from MY grad school alma mater, and all somebody’s daughters – because they were black. He used offensive, sexist, racist language.

    Therefore, he deserved to be fired. Because he is a RACIST.

    The only bad thing about Don Imus losing his job is that he got his job BACK.

    And if you can find a link to “him” (Obama?) attackiing Imus, I’d like to see it.

    The very fact that you would throw around a word like “lynch” just demonstrates how far some of us have to go. Once again, you’re behaving “typically.” You might want to think on that.

  18. clown face: Dude, read the “Comments policy.”

    It says that if you’re going to say mean things about, say, “the Special Olympics,” your remarks are going to be deleted.

    It’s pretty clear there.

    Play nice, or don’t bother. You can make your point without sounding like a sixth grader.

  19. Tom: What I did appreciate about this speech is that he got people talking. Not all to the good, but it’s obviously a conversation we need to have.

  20. Q-D:

    Rereading my comment, I realize how accusatory it sounds, as if racism is your problem rather than our problem.

    Let me add one line to my comment:

    “I am surprised that I still distrust and fear white people (including Quakers) on the subject of race.”

    Oops! I forgot to say “I am still angry.”

    The distrust, fear and anger clouds my seeing that of God in those I am arguing with.

    One of my favorite quotes from F & P is “They were changed men themselves before they went out to change the world.”

    Maybe I should take that hint personally.

    Tom T

  21. Tom: No worries, I got it.

    I was more concerned about that “arguing with a fool” part, actually.

    ;)

  22. The only proof that you need of the racial double-standard is that Wright’s remarks are routinely described as “racist,” “hate-filled,” “America-hating,” etc., while those EXACT SAME REMARKS are given a pass by the MSM when spoken by Jerry Falwell, James Dobson, John Hagee, Pat Robertson or Rod Parsley. Likewise, NO ONE has called John McCain to account for these comments (and other blatant anti-Semitic and anti-Catholic comments) made by preachers who support him. How many times has John McCain been called upon to renounce, denounce or disavow the tele-Pharisees who now support him?

  23. Where was the outrage when Falwell said the gays caused 911, or when Pat Robertson said we should go ahead and take out Hugo Chavez? I don’t think these things got nearly the coverage did they?

    And you are right to say that we need a conversation about racism in this country-involving all who live here. Don’t know how we could do it, but it would be a step in the right direction. I thought it would get better with the next generation, starting in the late 60s, is it any better now? I don’t think so, or it is improving so slowly it is imperceptible.

    “Race” and class have always been used to keep people apart who really have every reason to be united against the powerful and greedy. Think how different our country would be if the white indentured servants, the African slaves, and the native Americans had joined together against the oppressive ruling class. They are using the same tactics of fear and hate with Muslims and people from Mexico, Central and South America.

    Remember: “the people, united, will never be defeated.” When will we be united? It needs to be soon.

  24. Thanks for chiming in, Susan, and welcome. Your blog is impressive!

  25. Thanks Quaker Dave-and thanks for putting up info about our recent event in Atlanta (grandmothers for peace arrested…)
    We all had an interesting time in the Fulton County -quite an eye opener for me….I could post a bit about that if you start a thread, altho it really fits in with the racism thread too.

  26. Send me an email, Susan. I’ll post it as a new post. I’m sure we’d all like to read it.

  27. No. The problem is Obama is wrong, and not enough White people know it.

    I am offended at this lengthy blog posting’s characterization of typical White people. It used its portrayal of Whites to cheapen them. Let me tell you I have no black friends – by my choice. I see no value in it. I don’t pander to blacks – and never have. And I never spent one day of my life wondering what black folks think of me.

    Believe it or not White people have value. And if all your friends are White then they have value too. It’s hip, or popular, or a fad to be black right now. Their culture has hoodwinked much of the rest of the world. Obama has fooled a lot of people too. But the real Obama is an anti-White racist and a crook.

    Most people who live around blacks would move if they could. And the same goes for people who work or go to school with large concentrations of blacks. Why? Why is it that every ethnic group in America – not just Whites – dislikes and distrusts blacks? Because blacks victimize others. Blacks cheat. And when they fail or get caught blacks blame everyone else but themselves. Racism against blacks is a rational reaction to the reality of dealing with blacks.

  28. Wow, Lyn. This makes me so sad.

    But even you, too, have value. Even with all that hate.

    I’ll pray for you. Hopefully, some Light will seep in somewhere, some day.

  29. White folks have the damnedest time telling the truth about race. Doesn’t matter much if it’s Jerry Falwell, Bill Clinton or a Quaker. The difficulty extends to every camp of whites. Almost any non-white understands this to be a statement of the most obvious. This is why most non-whites, particularly black folks, aren’t courageous enough to get into conversations with white people on the topic of race. Particularly liberal whites. We understand that liberal whites can be counted on to do a few things that are, depending on the timing and context, helpful to non-whites. To try and discuss race just threatens what good relations there are because white folks will lie, lie, lie abouit race and there really isn’t much anything we as non-whites can do to stop the lying. And we know this. This is why many blacks choose not to work with whites.

    Anyways, Quakers could really be of use to this society and to the racially oppressed in this country if Quakers would analyze their own community around the topic of race. And after the analysis, take steps to mitigate and eradicate, not racism, but white supremacist dynamics, from their circles. If you are a Quaker, please don’t assume this isn’t directed at you. That’s what most Quakers do, I think. They grant that things aren’t perfect in the Quaker community but internally point the finger at others. But just about all Quakers are doing the same thing. Which is why racial progress in our society seems so dire to non-whites: white people continue to demonstrate that they are almost completely incapable of rational self-criticism in the realm of race.

    I found some hope in reading the initial blog post. There was reason there. But it all needs to go much, much further. It needs to be understood that all of these everyday kinds of ways in which white people find themselves self-segregating from non-whites is just a perpetuation of white supremacy. If you don’t have any real Black friends, you don’t have to look any further to understand the permanence of white supremacy. You’re a part of it.

    I’ve tried to reach out to dozens of white comrades. I’ve attempted to establish authentic relationships with them based on mutual respect; a difficult task inside a white supremacist society. While I am acquaintances and comrades with many of them to this day, we are not really friends. When it comes to living a life of struggle against white supremacy, almost every white person I’ve encountered can manage no better than to surround him or her self with other whites bearing witness to white privilege. Keeping in mind here that whites aren’t much in the way of racial self-critique. What whites seem to quite consistently if not universally avoid is establishing real friendships with Blacks and other people of color.

    Doing this might be interesting because it would force whites to deal with privilege and white supremacy in concrete ways instead of only bearing witness and engaging in pretend self-flaggelation. In this area, white/non-white relationships, Quakers could be leaders for white folks everywhere. But leadership would require self-criticism that I don’t know if Quakers or any whites for that matter, are serious and humble enough to engage in, yet. We’ll see.

    In Solidarity

  30. Thanks, Marc. I appreciate your thoughtful comment. I’ll add more when I’ve had a chance to ponder all you’ve said here.

  31. All I can really say in response is that, as a Quaker, I try to do better. I know that we here in this part of the country, around the Philadelphia Yearly Meeting, do try very hard to eliminate the dynamic about which you speak. Bearing witness is not enough, that’s for sure. Neither is self-examination and navel-gazing.

    I was trying for some of the self-criticism you speak about with this post. I guess I failed here.

    I’d like to keep this conversation going. Hope we can use this as a starting point.

  32. It’s not so much that you failed, QuakerDave. It’s not about you or any other individual Quaker. The problem is systemic. There is a personal dimension. And in that way, I applaud and support your effort. I am just one person but it seems that you are doing something good and needed. But the problem is bigger. It isn’t only an issue of individual Quakers or individual whites’ moral failings. Though history won’t allow us to forget that white moral failings have been a part of it, the problem is the entire system. Glen Ford, editor of BlackAgendaReport.com, a very worthwhile political journal, calls white supremacy the national religion, the Big Lie. The narrative of the US that erases the genocide of the indigenous people and the genocide of Afrikans being transferred from their homeland to the US to build this country for white people.

    The inability, as a collective, of us to tell the truth is where the problem begins. The problem certainly isn’t the inability to have a dialogue on race. There is no need for a dialog on race. History is clear. If only we can tell the truth about history, the ‘dialog’ wouldn’t be needed. Black and brown people built and continue to build this country for white people. Of course whites have been exploited as well. But the super-exploitation, the heavy lifting, has always been done by Black and brown people. And always done for either low or zero wages. That is the story of the United States of America. Everything else stems from that factual beginning. So dealing with the Big Lie is where we need begin. Deconstructing the lie in our communities explains the present reality. Much is known about the Jewish Holocaust. And rightfully so. It is an open secret that the lives of tens of millions of Afrikans were snuffed out in the quest for free labor for the white world. If only we could make it a habit to learn and then tell the truth. All of this soul-searching wouldn’t be needed. It is because we labor under the weight of sooooo many lies that it is so difficult to decipher this reality.

    We ponder the justice of Affirmative Action programs only because we refuse to acknowledge the reality of white supremacy which was four centuries of the original Affirmative Action programs for white people. Programs that continue to this day.

    Questions of what to do about public housing are only possible in the context of not acknowledging the millions of Black, brown and red families systematically and usually legally destroyed by whites. The legitimacy of most of our racial conversations are based on the Big Lie, making a ‘dialog’ on race in this country a contextual impossibility.

    So while your effort is laudable. The issue here is truth-telling beyond the individual. This society has been sleepwalking for centuries. It’s time to wake up. Community by community, congregation by congregation perhaps, truths need to be told.

  33. That’s one angry [EDITED].

  34. Dead thread , late post etc. etc.

    No-one will read it, but I dó have to react to the rather lengthy comment of Mr Marcg. Maybe someone will take notice.

    His vision seems to be that it all solutions have to come from te white side of the colour divide. Basically it sounds like : “You this.. You that…” It`s what Black Curacaoans very aptly call “a katibu-attitude”(look it up, and get even agrier if You wish)
    Fine, we whites will keep on wallowing in guilt ad-infinitum.

    It itches, however, just a teensy bit at the back of my head. A lot of religious people STILL point their finger at the jews for cucifying Christ, more than 2000 years ago.(If it happened at all) So..Will there never be forgiveness about anything amongst humans?
    How deep do whites have to grovel in the dirt, how many times do we have to say “Sorry”? (As a Dutcman with portuguese forefathers, my family was heavily involved in slave-trade..does that make ME guilty by association????)

    Is the fact that The Woman of my Life is Black(mixed African-Dutch) just a guilt-trip? And thus not worthy, because I happened to be born white? 25 Years of elongated guilt tripping?? I think not!

    Maybe I do not have the right and insight, as a foreigner, to comment on certain American affairs, but I keep wondering: Is the divide, the mistrust,the stereotyping, the bi-directional vile hatred totally uncurable, since slavery played such a big part in the wealth of the Western World, and The States especially?

    The bare fact that Marcg called a dialog a contextual impossibility in America does not leave a bit of an opening for change, does it?(actually, the post of “Lyn” really makes me ,even more, loose any hope of reconciliation…) His posts drip of seething anger towards a group with a common fenotype as a whole…..(see my point?) isn`t that called eh.”racism”???
    “White Supremacy”exists only if One bows to it. The term “white supremacy”is racist on it`s own terms, as it earmarks a whole group because they happen to have white skin, even if a lot of individuals in that group have no affinity with it al all.

    Maybe it is a bit different in The Netherlands. Race is not really an issue here. Mixed couples are very, VERY common. We do NOT have a race tick-box on university appl.forms, or any other “official” documents. My mother has studied in The States, and she still has the form where she refused to tick the caucasian-box.

    That form , for me, epitomizes the basic problem in The states. Worse even, no-one seems to think anything of it……..

    Do not get me wrong. There is still a fair amount of
    hate-mongering towards other groups over here, but that is mostly on the basis of their religion(Ask any Muslim in the Netherlands..their skin tone very seldomly is a problem, their religion/culture, however, very much is!!)

    I`m afraid I`ll have to say that people like Marcg and Lyn are no help at all. They are só entrenched in their distrust, they won`t even consider giving in a bit…

    Marcg keeps spitting over the fence, while Lyn turns her back and tries to ignore reality..

    shame…

  35. Never too late to chime in here, so thanks.

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